John 3:16

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[Sonic247]

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.  For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 

This is the most well known verse in Christianity, what do rastafarians think about it?

[Imanvex]

ill tell u what i think about it, and im not a rasta im a hebrew israelite descendant,

for god so loved the WORLD (the greek word for world is COSMOS, which means a seperate society of the world) because there are many worlds, the fish world, they even say africa is the 3rd world,
so the messiah was sent to die for the world of the ISRAELITES,
If he died for the whole world the greek word for world would have been OIKUMENE, like in luke 2 vs 1
matteew 1vs 21 for he shall save HIS PEOPLE for their sins not the whole world

[Sonic247]

But doesn't the Bible also say whosoever is athirst let him come and drink of the water of life freely.

[Imanvex]

yes ur correct but he was only talking to Israelites not the other nations

Matthew 15 vs 21 Then Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon.
 22And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.
(if u read in mark 7 vs 24 onwards it lets u know she was a greek -white woman- but she was just born in caanan thats why it says she was a woman of caanan)
 23But he answered her not a word. (The messiah ignored this greek woman) And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us. (she cried after them because once again THE MESSIAH IGNORED THIS WOMAN)  24But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost shhep of the house of israel.  25Then came she and worshipped him, (at this point she was bowing before him) saying, Lord, help me.  26But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs. (THE MESSIAH SAID ITS NOT GOOD TO TAKE THE ISRAELITES BLESSINGS ETC AND THROW IT TO DOGZZZZZ, the other nations)  27And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table ( SO SHE'S ADMITING SHE IS A DOG).  28Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.
(LOOK WHAT THE MESSIAH AND HIS DISCIPLES PUT HER THROUGH AND SHE STILL HUNG IN THERE,
HAVE U EVER HAD A DOG BEG AT UR TABLE WAITING FOR CRUMBS TO DROP, AND U WANT HIM TO GET
AWAY SO U DASH HIM A CHICKEN BONE, THATS ALL HE'S TELLING HER ABOUT HER FAITH, that she shud no her place,

lets look at what paul said ROMANS 9 VS 1 say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost,  2That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.  3For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:
 4 WHO ARE ISRAELITES; to whom pertaineth the ADOPTION, and the GLORY, and the CVOVENANTS (old and new testament covenants), and the giving of the LAW, and the service of God, and the PROMISES;

SALVATION IS ONLY FOR ISRAEL
acts 13 vs 23 Of this man's seed (david) hath God according to his promise raised unto ISRAEL A SAVIOUR, Jesus:  24When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of ISRAEL.
Acts 11:19Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the JEWS ONLY.

AND the reason is because they were commanded by the master
MATHEW 10 VS 5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and COMMANDED them, saying, GO NOT into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:  6But go rather to the LOST SHEEP OF THE HOUSE OF ISREAL.  7And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
 8Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give.

THIS PROMISE IS ONLY FOR U SO CALLED WEST INDIANS, AFRO AMERICANS, ALL THOSE WHO ARE
DESCENDANTS OF THE SLAVE TRADE U ARE THE HEBREW ISRAELITES.
AND ALL OTHER NATIONS ARE GOING INTO SLAVERY FOR WHAT THEY DID TO US DO U WNAT SCRIPTURE ON THAT TOO???

[I ELIJAH I]

im a hebrew israelite descendant,

Prove it.
You are not rasta. If you were an Israelite you would be Rasta, period. But you don't know the King. You have never been to Zion. What miserable little life you must have.


Posted on: April 08, 2008, 09:10:18 pmI knew it. Ones want to enslave as revenge. But I'm fool for talking about black racism but this one is saying that he is going to enslave anyone who not black. WHAT THE FUCK RASTA?  This one is not Rasta for sure and I'm going to smile so big when the King of Kings slams Zion gate in your face.
Posted on: April 08, 2008, 09:22:31 pm

THIS PROMISE IS ONLY FOR U SO CALLED WEST INDIANS, AFRO AMERICANS, ALL THOSE WHO ARE
DESCENDANTS OF THE SLAVE TRADE U ARE THE HEBREW ISRAELITES.
AND ALL OTHER NATIONS ARE GOING INTO SLAVERY FOR WHAT THEY DID TO US DO U WNAT SCRIPTURE ON THAT TOO???

So I guess your going to enslave all the people in Africa too right?
Posted on: April 08, 2008, 09:25:26 pmWhat a vanity. But let me tell u what this ones biggest problem is. He doesn't know that all prophecy has already fulfill. Creation is complete. The King is seated. So lets not here what the bible say but what Haile Selassie says "the decendants of slaves enslaving the rest of the world" when Rastafari END SLAVERY. NO one every slave again. But look at what BLACK NATIONALISM DOES. But all people have time for is pick on me. LOSERS!!!!!!!!!
Posted on: April 08, 2008, 09:33:33 pmBut let me just repeat this so it is very clear. Being an Israelite is a Distinction among Africans themselves. Jacob was born LONG LONG after Adam.

[Imanvex]

of course im not a rasta u eedyat, i am an israelite descendant, where in the bible do u read anyting bout rasta? or sillassi, u stupid eddyat, if ur ancestors where to see the way u try to speak they will chop
u up themselves, and YES ISRAEL will enslave ALL NATIONS on planet earth, u stupid eedyat, including the AFRICANS

[Human]

  

[RubADubDub]

Not that I support the suppression of speech, but is anyone else thinkin that vexed should either tone down and not be hateful or be perhaps silenced? First thing people see when they come here is some guy talkin bout enslaving all races... idk just my thoughts

[Joey Reborn]

Evening all, this is an old user lost his password and just popping his head round the door to see whats happening.  looks like things are a bit tense but never mind eh.

for god so loved the WORLD (the greek word for world is COSMOS, which means a seperate society of the world) because there are many worlds, the fish world, they even say africa is the 3rd world,
so the messiah was sent to die for the world of the ISRAELITES,
If he died for the whole world the greek word for world would have been OIKUMENE, like in luke 2 vs 1
matteew 1vs 21 for he shall save HIS PEOPLE for their sins not the whole world

not sure if this is definitely accurate.  though in the Gospel of John (and I think all of the gospels if the word is there) the word 'Kosmos' could be taken as just meaning the jewish community, the word can refer to the whole world, as you can look up in 1 Corinthians 4:9:

'We have been made a spectacle to the whole universe [Kosmos] - to angels as well as to men. ' (NIV)

This makes sense as obviously 'Kosmos' is the root of 'Cosmos'/universe.  Likewise, though Oikoumene can mean the whole world, as in Matthew 24:14:

'And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world [0ikoumene] as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come. ' (NIV)

. . . but it can also refer to a specific community, though you quote this as referring to the whole planet which it does not: only the 'inhabited world' which can refer to the Roman empire or the Greek-speaking world (two different communities):

'In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world [Oikoumene]. '

Also, doesn't the story of the Caananite woman suggest that Jesus had come as Mashiyach for the Jews (as you argue) but that if the Gentiles make an effort to humble themselves and come before a jewish master is search of help that they will partake of the 'crumbs'/will also partake of the same power? This is what I see in that Jesus' teaching  'fulfills' the covenant of the Jews but if those who were never involved in the covenant follow these teaching, they will also benefit.

Here is what I don't understand:

THIS PROMISE IS ONLY FOR U SO CALLED WEST INDIANS, AFRO AMERICANS, ALL THOSE WHO ARE
DESCENDANTS OF THE SLAVE TRADE U ARE THE HEBREW ISRAELITES.


This seems to be based on the literal interpretation of the kingdom of God (as was offered to the Jews through Jesus [according to the story you're referencing]) in which certain people will 'go' and others will not, as opposed to the metaphorical Kingdom of God representing a personal relationship with God as is quite clearly put forward throughout the gospels, especially in:

'The Kingdom of God is within. ' Luke 17:21.

So, if access to this Kingdom is not the 'promise' (covenant) you speak of then what is?

AND ALL OTHER NATIONS ARE GOING INTO SLAVERY FOR WHAT THEY DID TO US DO U WNAT SCRIPTURE ON THAT TOO???

Go for it.

Joey
Posted on: April 09, 2008, 10:37:17 pmExcuse me, imanvex, I see you have put the slavery quotes in the 'WANNABE ELIJAH' post.  Will look into it there.

[Imanvex]

here is ur responce to this joey, firstly in the new testement when it says

Acts 15:23
And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia. (and)
Acts 18:6
And when they opposed themselves, and blasphemed, he shook his raiment, and said unto them, Your blood be upon your own heads; I am clean; from henceforth I will go unto the Gentiles.

THE WORD GENTILE FROM THE GREEK IS GENTILIS WHICH MEANS FOREIGNER, U HAD ISRAELITES IN ISRAEL AT THAT TIME CALLING THE OTHER ISRAELITES WHO WERE SCATTERED IN EUROPE "GENTILES"

James 1 VS 1  James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes DISPERSED among the NATIONS: Greetings. (HERE IS PROOF THEY WERE CALLING THE SCATERED ISRAELITES GENTILES)

jOHN 7 VS 33 Then said Jesus unto them, Yet a little while am I with you, and then I go unto him that sent me.  34Ye shall seek me, and shall not find me: and where I am, thither ye cannot come.
 35Then said the Jews among themselves, Whither will he go, that we shall not find him? will he go unto the DISPERSED (remember james 1 vs 1 the 12 tribes who are dispersed) among the Gentiles (THE NATURAL GENTILES), and teach the GENTILES?

they was calling the dispersed israelites gentiles because they was following the ways of the greeks,
worshiping their idols,eating pig etc,

lets look at what paul said himself

ROMANS 9 VS 1 I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost,  2That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.  3For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my BRTHERIN, my KINSMEN ACCORDING TO THE FLESH:  4Who are ISREALITES; to whom pertaineth the ADOPTION (to be called sons of god), and the GLORY, and the COVENANTS (old testament and new testament), and the giving of the LAW, and the SERVICE of God, and the PROMISES;

ive answeard everything from the bible itself, if u have a problem then its not with me ur problem is with
the most high,
every1 has been taught lies in church they have not told u the truth, this truth is for ISRAELITES 
ACCORDING TO THE FLESH, not a spirtual jew like they teach u in church or wherever people tell u these
things its lies,

[I ELIJAH I]

Corinthians 1;12;13 For we were all baptized by one spirit into one body-whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free-we were all given the one spirit to drink.

[Imanvex]

good question elijah, but if u go into the greek word, where it says neither jew or greek,
the greek word is HELENIST which means GREEK SPEAKING JEWS.
DO UR RESEARCH...

[Joey Reborn]

if u go into the greek word, where it says neither jew or greek, the greek word is HELENIST which means GREEK SPEAKING JEWS.

Actually the Greek word in this verse is 'Hellen', for which the primary definition is Greek-by-nationality, though I concur that the word could be used poetically to describe someone who acts like a Greek.  However, in the verse from John that you quote, the use of the word Gentile (as you call them 'The Natural Gentiles') is the same as the 1 Corinthians quote above.  So either the word can be used in two different contexts or you were wrong to quote it in two different places to prove two different points.

I think that the word that you are referring to is 'Hellenistes', which is used in Acts 11:20 to describe the Hellenistic Jews in Antioch:
            'And some of them were men of Cyprus and Cyrene, which, when they were come to Antioch, spake 
             unto the Grecians, preaching the Lord Jesus. '

However, it is interesting that, as you say, the dispersed Jews were referred to as Gentiles (as you point out, even if it does seem to be with the wrong verses).  Let's say for a moment that you are right in pointing out that 'the truth' or 'the promise' as you call it is only for the Jews, the story of the Caananite woman shows that Gentiles can still have 'great faith' and can still utilise the power of the Mashiyach for their own ends.  The correlation here is that the Gentiles can have their own connection with Jesus whether he came for them or not.

So, once again, what is 'the truth' or 'the promise' that Jesus has given to the Jews; is it access to the kingdom of God?

[NyaInIJahLove]

Well this "Gentile Woman" is content wid di "crumbs"
Yes I, I may not be Israelite, that remains to be seen, although sum a de 12 tribes was known to disperse into England where i ancestors hail from, so yah neva know...
still His Majesty has seen fit to Grace I and I wid His Light...
So I say....His Light is so vast.....none can escape it, unless they deliberately shut it out, and dem I pity...
Ones seeking to Limit His Grace and Glory are surely unaware of its omnipresence
So I say Jah let Thy light be made apparent to those who seek to divide and Conquer
Colour or creed was never the main issue..
the main issue was always about the heart,Soul,mind,body allegiance
nuff Jewish, Isreal people strayed from dat and feel or have felt the consequences
Africans the same.....and of course plenty euro and Anglo gentiles.....
still, race wont save we, or damn we, its a personal journey
curse I if ya like, like I Son of Man
we speak the truth whether yah wanna hear it or not
cuz I and I Love ALL enuff to
Bless
Nyah I

[natty threads]

Why Ruth if gentile women cannot be "saved" or adopted into The Tribe?

Hello Joey- Nice to have you here.

Thank-you God for Jesus.
Thank-you God my Faith can make me whole.

Thank-you God for people like Imanvex so I can appreciate the gift of Grace.

Imanvex, you need Jesus.

Love.