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Author Topic: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?  (Read 28316 times)

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EmpressCarla

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #45 on: July 28, 2005, 09:23:23 PM »

Quote
greeting  empress  carla,  your  post  was  not  a  long  one,  but  you  sum  up  every  thing  that  i  have  been  trying  my  best  to  do  in  all  the  post  that  i  have  posted  on  this  forum,  IT  was  simpley  put,  but  the  simple  truth  is  always  the  best,  to  recap,  one  must  live  good  externally  if  they  want  to  reveal  the  light  within.  one  love  RASTAFARI.

Greetings ital, can you please explain this further? I am a bit confused. You're saying that in order to reveal the light within, we must first act? This seems backwards to me. Can you elaborate?

Be blessed.
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ital

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #46 on: July 29, 2005, 07:01:49 AM »

greetings  empress  carla,  there  is  only  one  reason  why  the  wicked  dont  know  truth,  and   that  reason  is  the  way  that  bad  people  behave,  you  cannot  live  good  with  god  while  ignoring  your  brother,  if  one  cannot  love  a  brother  that  one  can  see,  then  how  can  one  claim  to  love  jah  who  is  unseen,  we  must  learn  to  love  those  that  we  can  see  first,  before  we  can  learn  about  the  love  of  jah,  example  if  your  thief  you  will  not  know  the  light  within  untill  you  act,  the  action  you  must  take in  order  to  understand  what  is  within  is  to  stop  stealing,  the  more  we  live  our  life  honestly  with  those  around  us  is  the  more  we  reveal  what  is  within,  if  we  desire  growth  we  must  sow  our  seeds  in  good  ground,  that  means  we  must  act  good  in  our  every  day  life,  bad  actions  take  you  away  from  the  light  within,  while  right  actions  brings  you  closer,  we  should  look  at  our  own  faults  and  correct  them,  we  will  not  make  any  progress  untill  we  admit  our  own  faults,  and  begin  the  process  of  correction,  the  truth  only  reveal  itself  to  those  who  are  strieveing  to  live  good  with  their  fellow  human  beings.  one  love  to  jah  jah  childrens  RASTAFARI.
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EmpressCarla

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #47 on: July 29, 2005, 04:36:28 PM »

Thanks for the explanation, ital. That helps. I overstand what you are saying, however, I think that change starts from within. One cannot know the light within without first realizing that there is a light within. A thief cannot simply stop stealing without a catalyst. Their conscience would have to tell them that stealing is wrong. True change starts in the mind. The end result is a different action. So I disagree that acting alone will create change. For no change lasts until the mind is changed. A thief can simply stop stealing. That does not make them good on the inside if their thoughts are still wicked.

Matthew 5:28 says, "That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart." This is because the lust is born in the mind first. What is in the mind is what will eventually come out in one's actions.

So acting alone is not enough to reflect the light within. One has to start by acknowledging right from wrong. It begins in the thoughts. Thoughts turn into words, and once the word is spoken, it invokes action. Otherwise the actions will never remain consistent.

I agree with you, we must be able to love those who we see if we say we love Jah. Yet true love comes from within. From the knowledge of the Most High. From seeing the reflection of Jah in the individual. When we first change within, it is reflected without.

Be blessed.
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M-Dub

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #48 on: July 29, 2005, 04:39:06 PM »

Greetings and peace.

My way of finding light was kind of the opposite of what ital is explaining. When I was younger and poorer (money wise) I would steal and lie and such. It was when I found the light within and found Jah that I took the action to stop these things from happening. It wasn't until after I found Jah that I truly started taking positive action. Maybe I am a unique case?

One

Jah bless
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ital

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #49 on: July 29, 2005, 08:46:45 PM »

greetings  empress  carla  and  m  dub,  I  agree  that  everything   start  within  just  like  you  both  say,  but  if  your  conscience  tell  you  that  stealing  is  wrong,  the  choice  is  then  yours  to  steal  or  not  to  steal  if  you  decide  not  to  steal  then  you  must  apply  that  action  in  your  everyday  life,  put  it  this  way  it  does  not  matter  weather  we  say  it  start  within  or  without,  but  we  can  at  least  agree  that  for  us  to  know  the  light  within,  we  must  be  strieveing  to  live  good  with  everyone  we  meet  and  know  in  life,  to  live  negatively  is  to  move  away  from  that  light.  one  love  to  all  RASTAFARI.
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ital

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #50 on: July 30, 2005, 11:18:25 AM »

greetings,  what  use  is  it  if  one  knows  that  they  should  not  murder  but  still  do  it,  that  is  like  having  a  seed  that  you  refuse  to  sow,  and  if  you  do  not  sow  seeds  how  can  you  expect  a  crop,  knowing  the  truth  is  easy  everyone  knows  truth, even  the  thief  knows  that  stealing  is  wrong,  but  when  one  knows  that  stealing  is  wrong  and  live  a  life  not  stealing,  that  is  good  action,  good  actions  are  like  good  seeds  planted  in  fertile  ground,  if  every  thing  start  from  within,  that  mean  the  real  power  whatever  name  one  choose  to  call  that  power  must  be  within,  so  if  real  power  is  within  my  own  being  why  should  i  follow  a  next  man  who  is  outside  of  my  own  being,  either  one  realy  trust  in  the  power  that  is  within  their  own  being,  or  they  trust  in  someone  outside  of  themselves,  for  example  lots  of  people  put  their  trust  in  their  bible  even  thou  the  bible  is  outside  of  themselves,  they  have  faith  in  the  book  but  none  in  their  ownself,  they  have  faith  in  selassie  and  jesus,  but  none  in  their  own  being,  tell  me  why  should  i  put  my  faith  in  a  next  man  but  not  my  self,  unless  i  think  that  jah  created  the  next  man  better  than  me  witch  i  dont,  to  repeat  good  actions  is  the  key  that  open  up  the  doors  to  rightiousness.  one  love  to  all  who  live  on  planet  earth  RASTAFARI.  
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EmpressCarla

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #51 on: July 30, 2005, 06:29:44 PM »

ital, this argument seems to be getting quite old. You keep wanting to say that Jesus and Selassie are no better than the next man. Okay, I overstand you feel that way. However, if one has achieved a higher consciousness or even the highest consciousness attainable in this earthly realm, why do you seem to think it is wrong to follow that example? I'm not talking about following the man, but the example. It seems you would have each human being reinvent the wheel, which as you truthfully stated, each human being certainly has the ability to do. But what good does that do? Doesn't that just waste time?

By your concept, I see no point in ever reasoning on anything ever again. For all I need to do is look within all the time. That is ignorance and arrogance, though. For certainly, there are others who have a higher level of wisdom than do I. Why would I not follow the path they laid out? By doing so, I can attain that wisdom and perhaps even go beyond it! That is how all learning takes place: from within AND without. You can teach anyone to read (eventually) regardless of the method you use. However, if you find a way to reach the goal that is effective and can work for all, why would you continue to follow the haphazard approach? Why not follow the tried and true approach? Or even if you choose to remain haphazard, why try to force others to follow that as well? Why not let them see for themselves and choose for themselves?

Whether one follows Jesus or Selassie or Buddha or whoever, if what they follow is not the man but the spirit, which was Christly, then to me it makes sense to look at the archetype, the blueprint, in order to attain my own Christly-ness more expediently. This in no way implies I don't trust the light within. But it is the light within that is teaching me that all is One. So I have no need to negate anything outside of myself, because truly it is also within.

You seem to think that if a person looks for anything outside of themselves that means they don't trust themself. That is simply not balanced. That is not reasonable. That is the ego thinking IT is better than the next man. That the next man has absolutely nothing to offer. Well then I ask, what the heck are we doing here?! Why should I strive to live good with my fellow man if he has nothing to offer me in return? I should strive to live good with him for that very reason. That we all have something to offer the next man. We are interdependent. Some people cross our paths in life to show us specific things. That is part of their purpose. So why then can Selassie I or Jesus or whoever not have a purpose that they came to fulfill, to show me something that my own eyes simply could not conceive of?

Each one of us has a purpose. All we have to do is figure out what that purpose is and then get on with the fulfillment of it. I have met some who have helped me to see "the light" within myself much faster than I might have otherwise seen it because they know how to break down the truth to its simplest form. In so doing, I can see things much clearer. Now, certainly I could have attained the same knowledge on my own, but if they get me there quicker why should I reject that? Why should I declare that I can find this knowledge on my own, or by looking within when it is the Spirit within that has revealed itself through this person! That is foolishness, to think so highly of one's ownself and one's own abilities that we ignore the truth because it does not come in the form of our own choosing.

You asked, "tell  me  why  should  i  put  my  faith  in  a  next  man  but  not  my  self?" I don't think anyone here would say that you should. For the record, NO ONE SHOULD PUT THEIR FAITH IN MAN! My faith is not in ANY man. I have faith in Jah, and where He leads, I follow.

If we can agree that certain men have achieved the Highest Consciousness, and that is our goal as well, can you tell me why I should not look to their example whilst also looking within? And I am not talking about the man, I am talking about the "Conscience" of the man, which you said is the same in all. If Selassie knows our shared Conscience better than me, then why should I not look to his example in order to see how to further reveal Conscience in myself? If I ask, "Conscience, reveal yourself to me." And Conscience points me to the Christly example of Selassie and says, "Here's the way," should I still reject that?

I must say ital, in your insistance that one should not follow a Christly example, I am able to further validate for myself why I should.

Be blessed.
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ital

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #52 on: July 31, 2005, 10:23:33 AM »

greetings  empress  carla,  first  iam  not  having  a  argument  with  anyone  iam  just  reasoning,  can  you  tell  me  in  witch  one  of  my  post  on  this  forum  have  i  insisted  that  people  should  not  follow  the  christly  example,  that  statement  is  wrong  i  have  never  in  my  whole  life  say  any  thing  like  that,  people  are  always  accuseing  me  of  saying  things  that  i  have  not  said,  the  rest  of  your  post    is  the  same,  I  cannot  insist  that  a  next  person  should  do  what  i  say,  we  are  on  a  computer  if  you  are  anyone  else  think  that  iam  insisting  on  them  to  do  some  thing  that  they  know  to  be  wrong,  all  you  have  to  do  is  ignore  my  advice,  again  empress  you  might  not  understand  my  reasonings,  but  your  not  the  only  person  on  a  computer  and  if  you  read  this  tread  you  will  find  someone  else  with  a  different  opinion  of  my  post  than  yourself,  if  you  cannot  understand  anything  that  iam  reasoning  about  or  if  you  thing  that  iam  talking  rubbish,  or  if  you  think  that  iam  here  to  argue  with  you  or  anyone  else  please  do  not  respond  to  any  of  my  post,  if  i  was  reasoning  with  someone  who  was  totally  ignorant  like  myself,  I  would  stop  after  a  while  untill  that  one  learn  not  to  be  so  ignorant,   again  please  point  out  to  me  where  i  advice  people  not  to  follow  the  example  of  either  jesus  or  selassie,  I  know  that  i  have  not  done  so,  but  yet  you  insist  that  is  what  i  have  been  doing,  well  i  say  that  your  wrong  about  that,  not  only  that  but  everythings  else  that  you  accuse  me  off  as  well.  one  love  RASTAFARI.
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EmpressCarla

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #53 on: July 31, 2005, 03:01:40 PM »

I've said this before but I'll say it again. When I use the term argument, I don't mean conflict. I mean debate, reasoning. Honestly, you have taken my post too personally. Never did I say YOU were ignorant. So please brethren, stick with the topic at hand. Rather than telling me I should ignore you, why not just address my comments regarding why one should follow a Christly example.

Quote
again  please  point  out  to  me  where  i  advice  people  not  to  follow  the  example  of  either  jesus  or  selassie

Okay, here you go:
Quote
IT  suppriseing  how  many  people  claim  for  instant  that  they  know  jusus  or  selassie,  yet  they  have  no  idea  who  they  are  themselves ,   INstead  of  wasteing  time  trying  to  know  someone  that  you  dont  know  anyway,  the  time  will  be  better  spent  trying  to  know  your  own  self.

I am sure I could find many more like these, but I would rather not waste that time. My point is that your posts seem to continually focus on the man. Why? Do you feel that ones are following the man and not the Spirit? Perhaps I am mistaken, so clear it up for me. If you feel there is nothing wrong with following the Christly example, and that is what ones are in fact doing, then what are we talking about here? It has been said that Rasta do not worship man. I have not seen where anyone has refuted that fact. So, if Rasta is worshipping in Spirit and in Truth, why do you keep reasoning a point that everyone can agree on? Yet your reasoning seem to focus on saying Selassie is not god. Jesus is not god. It has been said that "god" is a title representative of the spirit. Not the man. So, where is the contention? Looking at it from that perspective, why can Selassie I not in fact be God to someone? If Selassie is the reflection of the Christly example, why should he not be hailed for showing us the way?

Be blessed.
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ital

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #54 on: July 31, 2005, 07:31:53 PM »

greetings  empress  where  about  in  the  example  that  you  site  in  your  above  post,  AM  i  adviceing  anyone  not  to  follow  the  example  of  jesus  or  selassie,  I    said  that  instead  of  wasting  time  trying  to  know  someone  that  you  dont  know  anyway,  the  time  will  be  better  spent  trying  to  know  your  ownself,  I   did  not  tell  anyone   that  they  cannot  follow  the  example  of  jesus  or  selassie,  if  some  have  their  faith  in  other  men,  while  others  have  faith  in  their  own  being  then  they  are  bound  to  see  things  differently,  once  again  iam  not  trying  to  convince  anyone  that  iam  right,  all  iam  doing  is  reasoning  about  what  i  know  myself,  I  do  not  believe  that  jusus  or  selassie  is  god  or  god  special  sons  over  anyother  human  beings,  men  who  follow  the  ways  of  god  yes,  but  god  no,  by  liveing  good  ourself  we  automatically  follow  their  example  anyway  even  thou  we  dont  know  them  personally,  I  have  faith  in  the  god  within  my  own  being  that  is  the  reason  why  i  have  my  own  opinions,  my  intention  is  not  to  offend  anyone  with  the  truth  that  i  know,  but  while  some  know  jusus  and  selassie  and  their  holy  books,  I  know  that  one  that  is  within  you  and  me,  i  do  not  know  a  lot  of  history,  but  i  know  the  one  that  dwell  within  all,  the  only  way  that  i  can  be  wrong  is  if  there  is  no  such  one  that  dwell  within  all,  but  if  such  a  one  exist  then  iam  right,  but  to  me  there  is  no  if,  because  i  know  that  one,  I  am  not  saying  that  one  should  not  follow  the  example  of  good  men,  or  that  there  is  no  thuth  in  the  bible,  but  iam  saying  to  you  that  if  anyman  knows  the  one,  then  that  one  can  follow  the  one  directly,  why  read  about  the  one  if  you  know  the  one,  again  all  iam  doing  is  reasoning  about  what  i  know,  if  anyone  dont  like  what  i  know  that  is  not  a  problem  like  i  said  before  anything  that  i  know  i  can  deffend  i  cannot  run  out  of  reasoning,  because  iam  intuch  with  the  source  of  reasoning  that  is  within.  one  love  to  all  jah  jah  childrens  RASTAFARI.
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EmpressCarla

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #55 on: August 01, 2005, 03:47:15 AM »

Is this something you see a lot of, ital? People having their faith in "other men"? For I know of no one here on this forum who fits such a description. Granted, I don't know the mind of anyone but my own. But I haven't read anyone's words to that effect since I began coming to this forum.

Moreover, if you see nothing wrong with following a Christly example, is your issue simply with the use of the term "God"? I guess I just don't overstand your position. I know that you keep saying Selassie is no better than the next man. And you say you never met HIM, so you don't know HIM. Yet you use the name that is ONLY and SOLELY associated with that "man". Ummm, I guess that's what doesn't make sense to me. If HIM is no better than the next man, why do you declare his name as though it is so worthwhile and significant to you? To be calling out some strange man's name???

Yes, I know the name is owned by Jah. That isn't the point. For the name Rastafari points to Haile Selassie I, King of Kings, Lord of Lords, Conquering Lion of the Tribe of Judah, et. al. If Selassie I is just a man, not a special son of God, then why are you calling out HIM's name? Is that not a contradiction to you?

It seems to me that you want to separate Rastafari from Selassie I. Is that accurate? If so, why?

Be blessed.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2005, 03:49:14 AM by Carla »
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ital

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #56 on: August 01, 2005, 05:26:47 AM »

greetings  empress,  IT  look  from  your  post  as  if  your  insisting  that  if  iam  useing  the  name  RASTAFARI  then  iam  calling  out  the  name  of  the  emperor  of  ethopia,  but  iam  doing  noting  like  that,  selassie  is  not  the  only  man  call  selassie,  what  make  you  or  anyone  think  that  in  the  whole  of  creation,  only  the  emperor  can  be  call  RASTAFARI,  who  made  that  rule  up,  it  aviously  does  not  apply  to  me  because  i  use  the  name  RASTAFARI  as  a  refference  to  the  one  that  dwell  within  all,  so  for  you  the  name  RASTAFARI  points  to  selassie  I,  while  for  me  it  is  one  of  the  name  of  the  one  that  is  within,  and  yes  empress  i  do  separate  rastafari  from  selassie,  selassie  was  a  man,  RASTAFARI  is  a  spirit,  the  spirit  of  RASTAFARI  dwell  in  selassie,  but  it  also  dwell  in  all  human  beings,  RASTAFARI  is  not  some  thing  that  belong  to  selassie,  RASTAFARI  is  for  all,  when  reasoning  about  the  source  that  is  within  various  names  are  used,  god,  allah,  IAM,  jah,  christ  within,  the  light, conscience,  and  in  this  time  RASTAFARI,  it  really  does  not  matter  to  me  what  name  i  use,  if  this  was  not  a  rasta  site  i  would  not  use  the  name  RASTAFARI,  IF  it  was  muslim  i  would  use  the  name  allah,  if  iam  reasoning  with  a  christian  i  will  not  insist  that  he  must  call  the  creator  RASTAFARI,  again  empress  yes  it  is  some  thing  i  see  a  lot  men  puting  their  faith  in  other  men,  the  men  who  blow  themselves  and  others  up  in  london  and  IRAQ  have  faith  in  what  other  men  tell  them,  take  this  tread  for  example  what  is  it  about,  how  come  you  cannot  see  all  the  people  on  this  forum  who  either  hold  the  belief  that  selassie  is  god,  or  someone  devine,  well  i  can  see  lots  of  people  on  this  forum  who  reason  along  them  lines,  those  are  the  ones  that  iam  refereing  to  as  following  other  men,  again  i  say  what  i  say  not  because  iam  hear  to  fight  against  anyone  or  to  win  any  reasoning,  I  say  what  i  sat  simply  because  that  is  what  i  know.  one  love  to  all  who  live  on  earth  RASTAFARI,  LION  PAW.
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paco

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #57 on: August 01, 2005, 05:59:27 AM »

ital, thanks for your xplantion on rastafari. is rastafari tha same as 'the christ' to you? the source, divine mind, life force the same as rastafari? is rastafari same thing as or part of conscience? one more question, if you don't mind brother, was the title Rastafari given to Haile Selassie? ifso why?


                             thank you, paco
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Whoever Brought Me Here, Will Have To Take Me Home - - -Rumi

Raszeb

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #58 on: August 01, 2005, 05:33:16 PM »

H.I.M. words

The salvation of our country Ethiopia, we have repeatedly stated to you, lies primarily in education. As Ethiopia is one, all Ethiopians are also one and education is the only way to maintain the condition.

We believe that from truth alone is born liberty and only an educated people can consider itself as really free and master of its fate. It is only with an educated people that representative and democratic organs of government can exercise their influence for national progress.

"...There is nothing more worthwhile and rewarding in life than to work for the benefit of others. One can derive more pleasure from giving than from receiving. We believe that each and every one of you who in leaving this institution(Asmara University) for his or her respective calling has come to realize that education is seldom prized merely on account of its usefulness to individuals. Nor is it intended to be a mere ornament and a mark of distinction and prominence to the persons who are fortunate to receive it. Those who have had the opportunity to learn should always be at the disposal of those who have not had its benefit. Therefore, it is not only the individual but the community at large which should benefit from the virtues of education. The words of the Holy Bible, "Give and it shall be given unto you," are worth observing in your daily lives. This momentous event should be a time in which you should reflect and pose to yourselves the questions, "what kind of service are we going to render to our country and what do we intend to accomplish in life?" It is our firm belief that if you forego self-love and self-indulgence and break away from worldly desires and you will be able to make great contributions to your family, community and country..."
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joeyb

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Re: Selassie Claiming He Is Plain Man - Your Take?
« Reply #59 on: August 01, 2005, 11:15:09 PM »

Blessings Idren. Sorry no post for a while (been reading.)

Ital: no personal attack, but do you ever consult the Holy Books?
Because I am still struggling to conceive how Man can solely lead himself. I praise God for leaders like Enoch, Noah, Moses, Isaiah, and of course Selassie I - and to be honest: I actually do wish to "know" them as much as possible. Wise Solomon was always saying that it is right and proper to follow examples, be taught and accept criticism and I myself am proud to be an Acolyte of wiser Idren!

But concerning Selassie I, I see HIM as much nearer Enoch than Jeshua. AnyOne see where I'm coming from here? For Enoch was as great as they get, and even described as Anointed One (i.e. Messiah.) But he wasn't the Messiah that Revelation prophesised, although my knowledge of the Scriptures is not what I desire.

OneLove
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